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davidoosnk

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Reply with quote  #151 

Curious whether you guys think Novastar and New Century, two public subprime lenders, will go bankrupt?

 

Thanks...

samzell

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Reply with quote  #152 

From Today's Wall Street Journal, defaults are spreading from subprime to Alt-A. 

 

 

Mortgage Defaults Start to Spread

New Data Show That Nontraditional Loans Are Beginning
To Haunt Borrowers With Midlevel Credit; Prime Still Fine
By RUTH SIMON and JAMES R. HAGERTY
March 1, 2007; Page D1

The mortgage market has been roiled by a sharp increase in bad loans made to borrowers with weak credit. Now there are signs that the pain is spreading upward.

At issue are mortgages made to people who fall in the gray area between "prime" (borrowers considered the best credit risks) and "subprime" (borrowers considered the greatest credit risks). A record $400 billion of these midlevel loans -- which are known in the industry as "Alt-A" mortgages -- were originated last year, up from $85 billion in 2003, according to Inside Mortgage Finance, a trade publication. Alt-A loans accounted for roughly 16% of mortgage originations last year and subprime loans an additional 24%.

The catch-all Alt-A category includes many of the innovative products that helped fuel the housing boom, such as mortgages that carry little, if any, documentation of income or assets, and so-called option adjustable-rate mortgages, which give borrowers multiple payment choices but can lead to a rising loan balance. Loans taken by investors buying homes they don't plan to occupy themselves can also fall into the Alt-A category.

BORROWED TIME
 
Default rates are increasing on so-called Alt-A mortgages, which include the following:
 Loans to borrowers with midlevel credit scores that fall between "prime" and "subprime."
 
 Many mortgages made to borrowers who provide little, if any, documentation of their income or assets.
 
 Option adjustable-rate mortgages, which give borrowers multiple payment choices but can lead to a rising loan balance.
 

Borrowers who take out Alt-A mortgages are considered less risky than subprime borrowers because of their higher credit scores. But as the housing market cooled and loan volume declined, some lenders lowered their standards for Alt-As. Now a rising number of borrowers who took out these loans are running into trouble.

Data from UBS AG show that the default rate for Alt-A mortgages has doubled in the past 14 months. "The credit deterioration has been almost parallel to what's been happening in the subprime market," says UBS mortgage analyst David Liu. The UBS report contrasts with testimony Federal Reserve Board Chairman Ben Bernanke gave to Congress yesterday. "Our assessment is that there's not much indication that subprime issues have spread into the broader mortgage market," Mr. Bernanke said.

To be sure, defaults have remained very low in the prime market -- and despite the uptick in bad loans, the problems in the Alt-A sector aren't as severe as those that have roiled the subprime market. Some 2.4% of Alt-A loans are at least 60 days past due, according to UBS, which looked at mortgages that were packaged into securities and sold to investors. That is well below the 10.5% delinquency rate for subprime mortgages. (During the housing boom, delinquencies were low for all types of loans because borrowers who wound up in trouble could refinance or sell.)

Some borrowers who took out Alt-A loans in recent years are starting to feel the strain. Johnny and Shirley Johnson, retirees in Cleveland, took out an option ARM when they refinanced their $92,700 mortgage in July 2005. The loan carried a 3.5% introductory rate that began moving upward a few months later. The couple, who live on a fixed income, are currently making the minimum payment on their loan. But they are afraid they won't be able to keep up with their loan and other debts once their monthly mortgage payment adjusts upward later this year.

"We don't want to lose our home," says Ms. Johnson. The couple is working with Acorn Housing Corp., a nonprofit group that provides housing counseling, in an effort to refinance into a 30-year fixed-rate mortgage. Though the monthly payment would be higher, the new loan would protect them against future increases.

Housing counselors and bankruptcy attorneys say they are seeing an increase in troubled borrowers who previously had good credit. "We have clients with 720-plus credit scores, and they are in awful products," says Jennifer Harris, executive director of the Home Loan Counseling Center in Sacramento, Calif. Some of these borrowers took out option ARMs with low introductory rates and are likely to fall behind when their monthly payment resets at a higher level, she says.

Thomas Gorman, a bankruptcy attorney in Alexandria, Va., says he is seeing more financially strapped borrowers who "probably bought more house than they could afford and then took on more credit-card debt" to furnish the house and pay for the move. When the housing market cooled, they were "caught in the middle," unable to sell their home or refinance and make their debt load more manageable.

Lenders are also tightening their standards. At a meeting with investors last week, IndyMac Bancorp Inc., the nation's largest Alt-A lender, said it had raised the minimum credit score at which borrowers could finance 100% of a home's value and took a number of other steps to tighten lending guidelines.

This week Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc.'s Aurora Loan Services unit raised the minimum credit score and reduced the maximum amount homeowners could borrower without documenting their income and assets.

Impac Mortgage Holdings Inc., which specializes in Alt-A loans, said recently that it had tightened its lending standards 17 times last year. The company cut back on riskier loans and began relying more on analytical tools to verify a borrower's income and creditworthiness. Other lenders were quick to scoop up many of those loans, but now they are also pulling back, says Impac President Bill Ashmore.

Lou Barnes, a mortgage banker in Boulder, Colo., says a client with a good credit score was turned down this week for a mortgage to buy an investment property with a small down payment and no documentation. That same borrower was approved for a "nearly identical" loan in August and November, he says. Still, Mr. Barnes calls the tightening "modest." Alt-A lenders are "nibbling at the edges," he says.

The UBS study found that the problems are greatest for Alt-A borrowers who took out interest-only adjustable-rate mortgages, which allow borrowers to pay interest and no principal in the loan's early years, with 3.71% of interest-only ARMs originated in 2006 at least 60 days past due. As in the subprime sector, the riskiest loans are those made to home buyers who put little, if any, money down and don't document their income or assets.

As delinquencies rise, some investors who bought lower-rated securities backed by these mortgages are likely to face losses, according to Mr. Liu of UBS. While defaults are expected to be lower than in the subprime sector, so are the reserves set aside to cushion bond investors against such losses.

Defaults are much lower for option ARMs. But the problems with these loans could be "backloaded," says Mr. Liu, because borrowers with these loans are still making the minimum payment.

Glenn Costello, a managing director at Fitch Ratings Inc. in New York, expects the foreclosure rate for Alt-A loans to ultimately be only 10% to 20% of the rate for subprime borrowers.

Yet investor concerns about Alt-A loans are rising, according to Walter N. Schmidt, a mortgage investment strategist at FTN Financial Capital Markets in Chicago. A report from mortgage analysts at Barclays Capital in New York this week pointed to fraud as one reason for early defaults on Alt-A loans. The mortgage industry is battling a rash of cases in which borrowers, loan officers and appraisers collude in providing false information to induce lenders to advance more money than homes are worth.

pasadena

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Reply with quote  #153 
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidoosnk

Curious whether you guys think Novastar and New Century, two public subprime lenders, will go bankrupt?

 

Thanks...

 

Weeelllll, as far as New Century goes:

 

 

New Century says it faces criminal probe
Subprime-mortgage lender warns it will likely breach lending covenant

 

http://tinyurl.com/3ey64c


 

"Subprime lenders without deposits depend on their warehouse lines," said Zack Gast, a financial sector analyst at the Center for Financial Research and Analysis, a research firm. "If New Century's lenders do not grant the requested waivers, the company is likely to be forced to sell or shut down."
 
Indeed, New Century warned that if it can't get waivers or covenant amendments from enough of its financial backers, the company's auditor, KPMG, will conclude "that substantial doubt exists as to the company's ability to continue as a going concern."
 
-----
 
And we all know by now that Fremont is exiting residential sub-prime:
 
New Century discloses a federal criminal probe, and Fremont says it is exiting the business. Regulators propose stricter guidelines.
 

 

See also the section on "stated income" (liar) loans:

 
"Under the proposals released Friday, lenders would be expected to:
...•  Fully document a borrower's income in most cases and not depend on the borrower's verbal representations alone."
Buh-bye (for most cases), stated income loans, it's been nice knowing yah!
 
-----
 
Sub-prime lending seems to be going down faster than a [insert proper allusion to prostitutes and 'shore leave/fleet week' here].
 
  - pasadena
Gekko

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Reply with quote  #154 

 

 

David Lereah, chief economist for the National Association of Realtors, is ready to call a bottom. But some markets still face corrections.

By Ellen Florian Kratz, Fortune writer

What about the problems in the subprime market? I was giving a speech in Atlanta about two years ago. During the question and answer period, someone asked me something about interest-only loans. I said, they're kind of dangerous and you have to be careful. Someone rose their hand and said, Did you know that in Atlanta, the percentage of interest-only loans in 2005 was 40 percent of the market? Atlanta didn't even have a boom.

That's when I knew we were in trouble. Regulators and the big lenders need to get together and work out some arrangements to accelerate refinancings. They need to take people out of these crazy loans and get them into longer term loans that work for them over the next 10 or 15 years.

Will problems with subprime have any effect on your sales numbers? I think in some areas yes. Foreclosures are going to happen in California.

You may see a rise in Las Vegas or Phoenix or Washington DC and parts of Florida, but it's not all over the country. The big problem right now is borrowers with a loan balance that may be greater than the value of their home. They have no incentive to make the mortgage payment. They'll say, I don't need it, take it. That's going to occur in some of the real unaffordable areas, like San Diego and San Jose.

What surprised you about the boom? The share of second home buying. It was 40 percent of the market in 2005. I was in shock. When you have a lot of second home buying, that's volatile, whereas when people buy a primary residence, they're buying it to live in.

I never anticipated that type of market share in second home buying. That proved to be the end of the boom.

 

http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/01/magazines/fortune/nar.fortune/index.htm

 

 

Gekko

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Reply with quote  #155 

 

New Century Said To Be Facing Bankruptcy, Possible Liquidation

 

 

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/djhighlights/200703050925DOWJONESDJONLINE000312.htm

 

 

Gekko

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Reply with quote  #156 

Subprime woes: How far, how wide

Problems loans to home buyers with less than top credit has become a big threat to the markets - and the economy.

By Chris Isidore, CNNMoney.com senior writer

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Lending to home owners and buyers without good credit has suddenly become a very bad business, and possibly a very big problem for the U.S. economy as a whole.

 

"People who a year ago could have purchased a house with a subprime mortgage aren't going to be able to purchase," said Paul Kasriel, chief economist with Northern Trust in Chicago. "Increased foreclosures will mean more inventory on a market that already has a glut of homes for sale."

 

http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/05/news/economy/subprime/index.htm?postversion=2007030514

 

reijoe

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Reply with quote  #157 
Gekko, since you seem to post a lot of references to articles warning of potential catastrophe, I'm curious to know what your strategy is or where you are positioning yourself in the present and the near future?
Gekko

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Reply with quote  #158 

Quote:
Originally Posted by reijoe
Gekko, since you seem to post a lot of references to articles warning of potential catastrophe, I'm curious to know what your strategy is or where you are positioning yourself in the present and the near future?

the answer is obvious: build up your cash reserves, reduce/eliminate debt and leverage, and reduce/eliminate negative cash flow.   get your umbrella ready, because the shiit storm is here.  if you are properly positioned, you should have no fear and you should be excited for the opportunities that are coming.  keep your powder dry but make sure the math works out based on historical metrics/valuations.  it's too easy to catch a falling knife.  have patience and let this thing play out.  cycles take time to play out - they always do.  look to history.  if the math doesn't make sense, don't do it.  good luck!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Paul

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Reply with quote  #159 
I had heard that this Pardee Community was selling very well. I checked it out last Saturday. The models were really busy, in fact you couldn't park in the lot, there was a guard directing cars to street parking...a pretty long walk. You would think it was 2003 all over again. They had sold 27 condos almost immediately upon release and then another 11 just on the day we were there.

The prices are in the high 200,000s. Good feature is a two car garage, bad feature --no patios, porches or yards. On a hot summer day (lots of em in Elsinore) the neighbors would be barbequing and hanging out all over the place. I was very, very surprised to see this level of success.

http://www.pardeehomes.com/ppc/sem1.php

burkej74

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Reply with quote  #160 

I'm also surprised at the pick-up in sales.  Granted the prices have decreased and some buyers are getting off the sidelines.  A close Realtor friend of mine who's been in the business for 20 years in San Diego told me he's very busy with offers and showings.  Maybe it's just a blip on the radar.  However, there's always deals to be made in any market. 

Gekko

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D.R. Horton CEO: '2007 is going to suck'

 

No. 1 U.S. homebuilder sees further write-offs due to unsold homes, lower value lands; expects '08 to be better.

 

March 7 2007: 5:08 PM EST NEW YORK (Reuters) -- D.R. Horton Inc., the largest U.S. homebuilder, expects homebuilders' pricing power to return by January 2008, after the hard-hit industry works its way through inventory of unsold homes, the company's chief executive said Wednesday. "I don't think '08 is going to be a great year, but it's going to be much better than '07," CEO Don Tomnitz told the Citigroup Industrial Manufacturing Conference. He also said: "'07 is going to suck." D.R. Horton said it may have to make further write-offs to reflect unsold homes or lower land values. "We may have more impairments coming," Tomnitz said. "We'll know that on a quarter-by-quarter basis." First-time homebuyers account for about 40 percent of the company's sales. Its treasurer, Stacey Dwyer, said subprime borrowers - those with weaker credit histories - account for fewer than 5 percent of its customers. The Fort Worth, Texas-based company, which builds homes in 27 states and had a backlog of 16,694 homes as of Feb 13, has demanded price cuts from its vendors and has reduced selling and general expenses in recent months, the CEO said. The company is targeting free cash flow of $1 billion in its fiscal year, which ends on Sept. 30. Tomnitz said in the current environment it was hard to determine the value of land, so merger and acquisition activity was not likely to pick up in the sector. The main purpose of a merger was to get another company's land and lot position, he said. "It's a little early to be talking about M&A," Tomnitz said. D.R. Horton, like its rivals Toll Brothers (Charts) and Pulte Homes (Charts), has cut the number of new homes it starts to build, but a large supply of existing homes is also forcing homebuilders to reduce prices or offer incentives. For example, in Las Vegas, formerly a "hot" market, there are 2,500 unsold new homes, Tomnitz said. But Las Vegas has 25,000 unsold existing homes, many of them unoccupied. The company's least profitable market right now is California, with particular weakness in the north and south of the state, Tomnitz added. D.R. Horton (Charts) shares, which had been up more than 1 percent earlier Wednesday, closed with a 1-cent loss at $24.55 on the New York Stock Exchange.

 

Find this article at: http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/07/real_estate/dr_horton.reut/index.htm?postversion=2007030717

 

reijoe

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Reply with quote  #162 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gekko

Quote:
Originally Posted by reijoe
Gekko, since you seem to post a lot of references to articles warning of potential catastrophe, I'm curious to know what your strategy is or where you are positioning yourself in the present and the near future?

the answer is obvious: build up your cash reserves, reduce/eliminate debt and leverage, and reduce/eliminate negative cash flow. get your umbrella ready, because the shiit storm is here. if you are properly positioned, you should have no fear and you should be excited for the opportunities that are coming. keep your powder dry but make sure the math works out based on historical metrics/valuations. it's too easy to catch a falling knife. have patience and let this thing play out. cycles take time to play out - they always do. look to history. if the math doesn't make sense, don't do it. good luck!



I was wondering more about any particular angle you have in mind. Buy at auction, buy reos, market to owners before the auction, low ball listings? Would you want to hold onto any of them, or just get in and get out as quick as possible? Are you trying anything right now to test the waters?
Tilt

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Reply with quote  #163 
I don't read these boards much anymore but I thought I would share this website, sorry if it is posted elsewhere.

http://ml-implode.com/


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Subcranium

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Reply with quote  #164 
I quite liked Jim Roger's "Hot Commodities," which I read last year. Looks like he's a housing bear as of today...

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSL1470530620070314

reijoe

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Reply with quote  #165 
What experience does Jim Rogers have in the real estate market? It says he has been in commodities since 1998. Is this guy just another big name throwing himself in the spot light?
Subcranium

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Reply with quote  #166 
As far as I know, he's got ZERO experience in RE investing. However, commodities traders often have a pretty good grasp of trends and macroeconomics, or else they couldn't make money. Considering how well he ran the Quantum Fund, I'd say he's pretty good at the big call.
taddyangle

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Reply with quote  #167 
Bad time ahead....
 
Generally speaking the decline in San Diego RE is about 1-2% based on the published numbers by DQ News.  It seems like a fantsyland, and I think the numbers are closer to 15-20% from the peak, and perhaps 8-10% over the year.  My general guestimate.
 
Anyway, with the most recent news from the sub prime industry, it seems as if we are begining the next step in a RE decline.  I am starting to believe that a 40% declines from the peak will be a reality.
 
If in fact we see this, will we also see a decline in interest rates? 
 
Back in the day I was able to get my primary on a 15 year loan at 4 7/8%.  I would like to have the opportunity to change some IO loans to 30 years for some of the investment properties.  For example I have a IO loan on a AZ 4-plex that will adjust in a little under 2 years.  The rate is 6.375% The current LTV is 58%.  Even with a dump I will be above the LTV needed to refi, and I do not plan to take money out. 
 
Anyone care to predict where interest rates will be in the next year or so?  Is there any flaw in my logic to think that I should expect a lower rate than what I currently have?  Seems to me things are going to get worse before they get better.
 
 

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Suzanne

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Reply with quote  #168 
From the Tribune,

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20070322/news_1n22census.html

Suzanne
Gekko

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Reply with quote  #169 

the bad times for some are HERE.  let the bloodbath begin.


Mortgage crisis overwhelming credit counselors

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/03/22/subprime.counselors.reut/index.html


reijoe

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Reply with quote  #170 
I was listening to NPR in my car on the way to a lunch meeting today and heard a panel of people discussing foreclosures and the (paraphrased, I forget the exact adjective) "horrible housing market" and how it is severely affecting minorities. They even went so far as to cry foul that the predatory lending over the last few years is evidence of racism in America today, because it was targeted at minorities. In practically the same breathe, this same panel lambasted the current government for not helping enough minorities get into home ownership. The desperation in this panel's tone of voice was actually rather alarming. It almost sounded as if they were grasping at any reason to complain about the current housing market.

On a side note, they pulled out some statistics for the city of Detroit that I was surprised to hear. They said that unemployment in the city of Detroit was 14% and nearly 1/3 of the population lived below poverty. Being from that area, I knew it was bad, but I didn't realize it was that bad. Although, this is the city of Detroit proper, not the Detroit metro area. The Detroit metro area is much healthier, even if depressed.

And from the article above, I see this:

Shanna Smith, chief executive of the National Fair Housing Alliance, said lenders often targeted the most vulnerable borrowers for subprime loans, even if they were eligible for loans with lower rates. More often than not, the borrowers had little understanding of mortgages.

"All the predatory lending that has gone on, all of the pushing of exotic loans on people of color, female-headed households, families with children, people with disabilities -- it's all coming home to roost," Smith said.


Why don't we just call them stupid? Sheesh, people look for any reason to be a victim. I'm sure some average middle aged white guy working as a car mechanic understood it just as much as the types of people mentioned above.


I would also expect the foreclosure counseling services to be overwhelmed because they've had nothing to do for the last 5 years, so they probably left for other jobs. We really need to keep all of this in check and compare it to the mid 90s or earlier before we start to get all worked up.

And then finally, I see this:

At the nonprofit Consumer Credit Counseling Service in suburban Cincinnati, counselor Darcy Blankenship sees a steady stream of people who knew their payments would be going up, but signed the loan anyway because they just wanted a house.

"People are so excited about wanting that house, they don't look at the whole picture. They just want the keys," she said.


Tell me exactly why I should feel sorry for these people? They were just plain greedy.

Subcranium

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Reply with quote  #171 
I think a reason the regulators let these loans happen was precisely BECAUSE they were seen as benefiting minorities. If someone tried to reign them in two years ago, they would have been shellacked as racists.
RobertCampbell

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Reply with quote  #172 

Tell me exactly why I should feel sorry for these people? They were just plain greedy.
 
Plus, the vast majority of them committed loan fraud.   That little fact seems to be under-emphasized by those who now want to be classified as "victims."
 
Sorry, but no tears from me. 
 
Robert Campbell
 
 


Paul

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Reply with quote  #173 

AP
Home Sales Rise Unexpectedly in Feb, largest amount in 3 years
Friday March 23, 10:48 am ET
By Martin Crutsinger, AP Economics Writer


Existing Home Sales Rise in February but Worries About Subprime Lending Increase

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Sales of existing homes unexpectedly rose in February by the largest amount in nearly three years, but analysts expressed fears that the recovery for the battered housing industry will be slowed by spreading troubles in mortgage lending.


The National Association of Realtors reported Friday that sales of existing homes rose by 3.9 percent last month, pushed higher by a sharp increase in sales activity in the Northeast. It was the biggest increase since a similar increase in March 2004.

The increase pushed sales up to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 6.69 million units, still 3.6 percent lower than a year ago. Sales fell by 8.5 percent for all of last year as housing hit a sharp slowdown after setting sales records for five straight years.

Analysts, who had been looking for sales to decline in February, said the increase reflected warmer weather in the Northeast and Midwest and said that the housing industry is still not on a sustained rebound.

"Sales cannot be sustained at this level, which is way above the pace implied by mortgage applications," said Ian Shepherdson, chief economist at High Frequency Economics.

The price of a median home sold last month dropped to $212,800, down by 1.3 percent from the same month in 2006. It marked a record seven straight months that the median home prime has fallen compared to the same period a year ago.

Analysts said the price declines were helping to lure buyers back into the market. But analysts expressed concerns about what the growing problems in the subprime lending market will do to the prospects for future sales.

Subprime mortgages were offered to people with weak credit histories who could not qualify for standard types of mortgages. Now an increasing number of those mortgages are going into default. That is forcing lenders to tighten up on their loan standards, meaning people who would have qualified for subprime mortgages will not be able to do so.

David Lereah, chief economist for the Realtors, said he believed that demand for homes could be cut by 150,000 to 200,000 annually over this year and 2008 because of the lending troubles.

"Our view is that the tightening in the subprime market will have a negative impact on home sales," Lereah said. "It probably won't postpone the recovery (in housing) but it will slow it."

By region of the country, sales were up 14.2 percent in the Northeast, a gain that was attributed in part to warmer-than-normal weather this winter, which spurred sales.

Sales of existing homes were up 3.9 percent in the Midwest and 1.6 percent in the South, while sales were unchanged in the West. Lereah said the reluctance of sellers in the West to trim prices was holding back a rebound in that region.

reijoe

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Reply with quote  #174 
Here's an anecdote. I just talked to a broker in Casa Grande, which is along I 10 between Tucson and Phoenix. He said that new construction that was selling at $140 to $150 per sq ft at the peak is now being listed at $85 to $90 per sq ft. But in the same conversation, he also said that builders will buy land if it is priced right. To me, this says 2 things: 1) if value is perceived, transactions will still occur, and 2) the builders have had major profits buffers built into their prices over the last few years.
Subcranium

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Reply with quote  #175 
I love how the NAR reports the rise in month over month sales but ignores the loss in year over year sales.
Gekko

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Reply with quote  #176 
 
2:43pm: Sales rose 3.9% last month but the gains came as sellers cut prices, even before subprime woes hit.
Gekko

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Reply with quote  #177 

Spring Fever

Just how sick is the housing market? It's time to find out

By Alex Markels
Posted 3/18/07

Call them the three stages of real estate grief.

At first, there is denial, like the kind John Davis and his wife, Jeffy Griffin, were living in when they put their three-bedroom home in Boulder, Colo., up for sale last April for $850,000. "We were pretty unrealistic," Davis, a 47-year-old licensed clinical social worker, admits of his hopes for selling the charming but small farmhouse near downtown. "We just figured it's such a great house ... in the perfect neighborhood."

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/biztech/articles/070318/26real.htm


landfx

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Reply with quote  #178 

By Kevin Krolicki Mon Mar 19, 11:48 AM ET

DETROIT (Reuters) - With bidding stalled on some of the least desirable residences in Detroit's collapsing housing market, even the fast-talking auctioneer was feeling the stress.

"Folks, the ground underneath the house goes with it. You do know that, right?" he offered.

After selling house after house in the Motor City for less than the $29,000 it costs to buy the average new car, the auctioneer tried a new line: "The lumber in the house is worth more than that!"

More...
 
HungryBear

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Reply with quote  #179 

reset1.PNG

taddyangle

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Reply with quote  #180 
Holly $hit.  That chart is amazing.  WOW.

That chart makes it real easy to predict the future.  Will we see the deals in 24-30 months?



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